57: Nourishing Your Way Out of Burnout
With Dr. Karen Lamb, Naturopathic Doctor + Licensed Counselor
Do you constantly feel exhausted? In this episode, I talk with Dr. Karen Lamb about the connection between sensitivity and burnout as well as:
• The emotional and physical signs of burnout
• What nutrients are essential for deep processing
• Why sleep, hydration, and digestion are essential areas of physiological self-care
Karen is a Naturopathic Medical Doctor and Licensed Counselor specializing in helping highly sensitive and neurodivergent individuals balance hormones, restore energy, and truly thrive. With a deep understanding of the unique needs of HSPs, she blends integrative medicine and trauma-informed counseling to create personalized, sustainable wellness solutions. Through her work, she empowers sensitive individuals to honor their bodies, overcome burnout, and reclaim their vitality.
Keep in touch with Karen:
• Website: https://puravidanaturalmedicine.com
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dr.karen_lamb
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/share/g/12GpdYWThg2
• Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/drkarenlamb.bsky.social
Resources Mentioned:
• Sensitivity Burnout Quiz: https://puravidanaturalmedicine.com/quiz-for-hsp-burnout/
• Thriving Sensitivity Course: https://pura-vida-natural-medicine.kit.com/products/self-study?promo=HSPTHRIVE
Thanks for listening!
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Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/sensitivestrengths
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This episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Some links are affiliate links. You are under no obligation to purchase any book, product or service. I am not responsible for the quality or satisfaction of any purchase.
Episode Transcript
Dr. Karen Lamb: 0:00
I do think that we have a very significant susceptibility to burnout symptoms or some of these health concerns that we're talking about, because we process the world as deeply as we do, and every experience of sensory data requires a chemical reaction. If we see light more brightly, hear sounds more intensely or emotions more intensely, those chemical reactions require nutrients.
April Snow: 0:38
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the people who live with hearts and eyes wide open. I'm your host, psychotherapist and author, april Snow. I invite you to join me as I deep dive into rich conversations with fellow highly sensitive people that will inspire you to live a more fulfilling life as an HSP without all the overwhelm. In this episode, I talk with Dr Karen Lam about why HSPs are more susceptible to burnout and other health struggles, as well as the importance of hydration, nutrient intake and sleep.
April Snow: 1:16
Karen is a naturopathic medical doctor and licensed counselor specializing in helping highly sensitive and neurodivergent individuals balance hormones, restore energy and truly thrive. With a deep understanding of the unique needs of HSPs, she blends integrative medicine and trauma-informed counseling to create personalized, sustainable wellness solutions. Through her work, she empowers sensitive folks to honor their bodies, overcome burnout and reclaim their vitality. For more HSP resources and to see behind-the-scenes video from the podcast, join me on Instagram, tiktok or YouTube at Sensitive Strengths or sign up for my email list. Links are in the show notes and at sensitivestoriescom. And just a reminder that this episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Let's dive in. Hi Karen, I'm so happy to talk with you today on the podcast.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 2:36
Thank you. I am so happy to be here and to get to chat about one of my all-time favorite things sensitivity. This is really exciting for me.
April Snow: 2:46
Yeah same. And just hearing your expertise and perspective on our sense of experience with burnout and energy management and I'm sure there's so many other topics we could cover Might have to have a part two, but before we get into that, I'd love to start off and just hear a little bit more about your own HSP discovery story, how and when you realized that you're a highly sensitive person.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 3:08
Yeah, I appreciate that you say highly sensitive, because I was told I was sensitive my whole life. I mean, I'm sure so many of us hear that. And growing up, I definitely always felt things deeply emotions, energies in the room, or even just the way that my body and other people's bodies responded to stress. It was always very apparent to me and it wasn't until I read Elaine's work, which was about 20 years ago now, that I thought, oh, oh.
April Snow: 3:47
Yeah, you get it. Yes, the puzzle pieces start coming together. Wow, yes.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 3:53
I hope that someday I can I mean, maybe I could just send her a thank you.
April Snow: 3:57
I mean, it just was so transformative, I mean it's incredible just to have that insight of going from okay, I've been called sensitive, just that generic term, but then to realize, oh, there's more to it, it's a trait, there's a framework, there's language for it. It is so illuminating to have that light bulb come on like oh, now it all makes sense. At least that was what it was for me. Finally, Absolutely.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 4:25
It really did. So much came together for me at that point. And then, right around that time is when I went to naturopathic medical school and I started to notice that the sensitive people in my program and I had different nutritional needs. And then I mean it was just very serendipitous, you know, like it was time for me to awaken that awareness. And then I realized, okay, I'm a highly sensitive person and my approach to wellbeing looks different than others beyond the bath and the downtime you know all of these things.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 5:06
It was also making sure that I was learning how to replenish these nutrients, and it was just the tip of the iceberg for really passionate journey for me. I'm really grateful to get to do these things in my work because it just I feel like this is my purpose and I think, as sensitive people like our connection to our purpose. I know it's important for everyone. I don't know why I just feel as being highly sensitive, it's almost non-negotiable, you know, to really thrive.
April Snow: 5:39
Agreed, agreed, I think, because we are so connected to our internal experience, our emotional landscape. When there's that sense of disconnection or lack of purpose or even boredom, we feel it so much more deeply. So I do. I am in agreement with you. I think purpose and alignment with what we're doing in kind of our life's work is so much more important for us.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 6:02
I think that's beautifully stated. Yes, you feel it, you feel it right, so deeply we can't ignore it.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 6:10
And that's why not to get too far off our topic, but I guess it's not far off. I think that there is this whatever anybody's beliefs are like bigger reasons for us, aside from evolutionarilyarily right. I mean that that's clear, that makes sense. I don't know. I feel like we're kind of like the heart and actually you mentioned that in your podcast. I love that. We are the heart of our species, you know, and we can't ignore certain things, and sometimes it's the canary in the coal mine type of situation, and sometimes it's. You know we can do better.
April Snow: 6:51
Yes, elevating the expectations or the standards. That's part of our purpose here.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 6:56
Yes, I completely agree. Sometimes it can almost sound a little grandiose. But I don't know, I don't think it's grandiose, I think we're special, you know, in that regard. But other people will say we're not special because we can't do mass production of work, right, right.
April Snow: 7:12
But I see it as you know, everybody is special in their own way. The people that are non-HSP is more extroverted. Whatever it is, they have a purpose too. It's just different than ours, right? I mean, we're the noticers, the feelers, the emotional leaders, and let's not discredit that.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 7:29
Yeah, absolutely, and I think it's particularly special in at least the way I see it, because I love those things, so I'm like that's so special, it's extra special, right?
April Snow: 7:42
It's so meaningful to us, yeah, it is. And, yeah, purpose is so important because of that.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 7:48
Yeah.
April Snow: 7:49
Yeah, you mentioned nutritional efficiencies and I know we might talk about this later, but I didn't want to lose that moment. You said, when you started studying naturopathic medicine, you realized, oh, I have different nutritional needs. So I think that's an important layer to be able to find purpose, to be able to live well, to not feel like we are living under that fog of overwhelm and burnout, which we'll talk about. I mean, one of you could just say a few things about that, what you were noticing.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 8:20
Yeah, it first came to my awareness during school when we were talking about vitamin C and one of the ways that we naturopathically assess vitamin C. Because you can do an expensive specialty test that will do like a micronutrient test that tells you you know what kinds of nutrients you're low on or high on, and then that can have some implications. But there's a really easy way to test it with your bowel tolerance and and so you can take certain. You can do 500. For sensitive people I usually recommend like 250 to 500 milligram increments. Non-hsps jump to one to three grams, but sensitive people it can go either way. There can be a super high requirement for it or really low.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 9:07
So I noticed that there were about a hundred of us in our class and the people that I kind of had tagged as HFPs were all talking about having had much higher bowel tolerance for vitamin C, which is particularly fascinating because vitamin C is important in the conversion and the production of epinephrine and these stimulating fight or flight types of brain chemicals and neurotransmitters. And to me, once I put that together which was very similar timing to Elaine's work, you know, and me being exposed to it I was like, oh man, there is so much here. Yes, yeah, so it started with vitamin C.
April Snow: 9:54
I mean there's so much because we talk a lot about our emotional differences, our nervous system differences, but why wouldn't there also then be nutritional differences? Of course, because I mean we're living in an interconnected system. I know we treat our bodies as these separate silos, but it's all part of the same system. What an interesting discovery, I imagine you know. Having worked with more and more HSPs over the years, you've been able to see more of that 100%.
April Snow: 10:22
Yes, so we really do need to take care of our bodies differently, as well as our emotions 100%.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 10:29
Yeah, especially to be able to thrive in the way that I want all HSPs to thrive, right Like what an amazing world we would live in if we felt really nourished and grounded and in a place we can shine as brightly as we know is possible.
April Snow: 10:48
Right, exactly, it's like we just need something different to be able to do that. So in your work with HSPs I know you've personally struggled with burnout, but I imagine see that a lot, whether it's burnout or energy depletion or other physical symptoms. I'm just curious if you could share a little bit more about what those signs of burnout might be nutritionally or physically or emotionally that you're picking up in your practice.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 11:13
Yes, you know, the easiest way to answer that and we can get into the specifics but the easiest way to answer that is the experience of a highly sensitive person when it becomes painful and is sustained, right. So the over-stimulation for some of us, emotional reactivity, emotional exhaustion, increased sensitivity, so all of the things that can be wonderful. Gifts kind of feel like they're working against us. Gifts kind of feel like they're working against us. And when we are there for an extended period of time, I think as HSPs we always have, you know, once a week or maybe at the end of the day, where it's like, okay, it's time, it's time for me to, you know, stow myself away, I will see you all tomorrow. But if that's the state that somebody is in, you know, really continuously, then it's worth exploring.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 12:08
Sleep issues become really prevalent during burnout. A lack of joy or passion, which is that light that I would love all sensitive people to connect with and shine system starts to get really wonky. So if we're exposed to high levels of cortisol for an extended period of time, then that has an immunosuppressive effect and so we'll start to see, you know, frequent colds. Or if somebody has an autoimmune condition, then more flares of that autoimmune condition.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 12:42
Food cravings can also come up with burnout, especially salty or sweet, which is like, okay, well then, what's left? Great. But those are really common for adrenal fatigue, brain fog, increased indecisiveness. I know we all, as you know, we tend to be very intentional about our choices and our decisions, but if it's just feeling like you can't get to a conclusion or make a decision and it's taking over, you know, in different elements like procrastination or perfectionism also tend to flare, and these are all things that I think we as sensitive people will come in and out of. But it's that constant state and what it really comes down to is when the nervous system gets stuck in that sympathetic or fight or flight state that leads to burnout because it's just the foot pressing on the gas constantly and that is really incompatible with sustainability, especially for a sensitive person.
April Snow: 13:42
Absolutely. You can't be in that dysregulated state, that depletive state for extended periods yeah, one day a week, the end of days when you've gone through and you've done all that you can.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 13:53
But if you're stuck in that, it sounds like every system of the body is then impacted yeah yeah, exactly I actually put together a little quiz very, very old, like do it manually, like those old magazine quizzes, and I put it on my website because I'm just not tech savvy and I wish I was, but I'm not and it's a nice resource. If people are curious about that, I can give you that information, because I don't think I mentioned it earlier.
April Snow: 14:20
Yeah, that would be great. I'll put that in the show notes, for people Sounds good. Yeah, yeah, cause I know there can be a lot of different signs that you're going through burnout and they may not always be obvious, right, or maybe what you would think.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 14:35
Yeah, yeah. And I think that when we get into that state of burnout and things feel so stuck and I mean, I think I was in a constant state of burnout until I learned about this, about how to take care of myself so it was like from, I think, probably puberty, right when hormones came on the scene and life got so much more complicated especially with my sensitivity it was just constantly feeling burnt out. And when we get into that state of stuckness, there is this we feel so profoundly under-resourced that the idea of anything changing feels absolutely impossible or helplessness, and it's not that right. There is absolutely ways for each individual sensitive person to find a way out of it, and I think that's why I feel so passionate about it, because I know what that feels like and sometimes the solutions can feel so distant and impossible because we're so under-resourced.
April Snow: 15:40
Yeah, we're living in that chronic under-resourced space as HSPs, often either because of circumstances or we do it to ourselves, not realizing that we should or could treat ourselves differently. So how do we start to come out if we're in that sense of hopelessness?
Dr. Karen Lamb: 15:57
I mean knowing that there is a way For me. I think that when I learned that there were different nutritional needs for sensitive people, it was like a whole world was opened up to me and all of a sudden I felt like I needed to learn it, which was quite the feat because I didn't have anybody really there world. There are many providers that are certainly way more sensitive than non-HSP you know, conventional medicine providers, but not all naturopathic doctors are highly sensitive and oftentimes some are and don't know it or still kind of function on a more conventional paradigm. And so I had a wonderful naturopathic doctor who understood my sensitivity as best as she could and honored it, and that was already light years from the medical gaslighting that I had experienced conventionally. But it was really up to me, you know, to lay that groundwork of okay. So now I know vitamin C and that makes sense to me.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 17:03
What about? You know everything else, and I kind of became a guinea pig for myself and the work that I do. And now I find it so empowering to have you know my immune system basket and my mental health basket and my energy basket, and knowing that I have these resources whenever something is feeling a little bit off just feels really empowering to me. So kind of like in DBT, we would teach people to have their self-care basket, which when I learned that, was really important for me as well. So it's implementing these different concepts of self-care that now include physical health, which was really revolutionary for me.
April Snow: 17:55
Yeah, we often don't think about the physical health in the context of emotional struggles like burnout. We think of it more as you know, I'm overwhelmed, I'm overstimulated. But yeah, there's a physical component there. You differentiate the mental health basket, the immune system basket, the energy basket. Are you open to sharing maybe an example from each of those?
Dr. Karen Lamb: 18:17
Yeah, so you know, obviously sensitive people are very unique in our needs, but I can speak to the things that are most comprehensively well-tolerated for sensitive people. It's just, you know, as you've mentioned, this is impossible to be medical advice, because when working with sensitive people it's so, so unique and that feedback that we get, that live feedback from the body, is really important to take note. But vitamin C, of course. So vitamin C it's anti-inflammatory, it's, everybody knows, supports the immune system and it can be emotionally stabilizing, because anytime a nutrient is deficient the alarm bells go off. So anxiety, depression, fatigue, these are really really general physical signs that our body's not getting what it needs. And vitamin C plays a role in so many. It plays a role in the hormone system, so the endocrine system, the neurological, mental health, brain chemistry system, the immune system, the digestive. I mean it is very, very prevalent, so it's one that gets you a lot of leverage and that's why I love to start with vitamin C.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 19:41
There are some this is me going into, you know, the possibility that it might not be good for you, but if some people with oxalate sensitivity, which actually a lot of people do have, might not respond well to vitamin C. So, if ever you are introducing something new, always listen to your body. I can't stress that enough, especially for this population. Right, like we have the ability to be finely tuned instruments and when we aren't I mean that's the experience of burnout right, our music starts to sound a little wonky. Whenever your music starts to sound a little wonky, your body isn't aligned. Listen to that. It does not matter what a provider says. Always prioritize that.
April Snow: 20:24
That's such a good reminder that we really need to let it be subjective what is best for me and in every area of life. Let's not look outward to what everyone else is doing. Let's look inward, and I've experienced that myself, just having, over the last year, worked with a functional medicine doctor and corrected some deficiencies and seeing the inflammation go down and my mental health shift. It's like wow. It's just a reminder that everything is connected. But to listen to what do I need? Yes, so important, right. Yeah, it's so powerful.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 20:58
Yes. So vitamin C and what else is in my basket? What other baskets do I have? So that's going to be immune. That's the really big one.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 21:07
Magnesium you're hearing a lot about magnesium. We do tend to have a lot of deficiencies with magnesium, because magnesium helps to relax things and, as sensitive people, especially when we're in a state of burnout or are in this kind of reactive fight or flight state, everything gets really constricted right Thoughts, bowels, blood vessels, everything gets really tight and magnesium can help to provide some ease. There's lots of different forms for sleep, versus cognitive anxiety or overthinking types of tension. But generally speaking, you can do bowel tolerance for magnesium as well. So you could start with something like 100 milligrams and add 50 to 100 milligrams every day until there's loose bowels, and then you take a break and then you start back up at one or 200 milligrams lower than what triggered the loose stools.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 22:07
Same with vitamin C. So that's a really nice, easy way to test those for yourself. If you have low blood pressure, be careful with that because it can it will, you know relax the blood vessels, which can decrease blood pressure, and if there's any kind of bone density problems, because magnesium and calcium will compete for one another. I'm going to pause here because I can talk about this oh yeah, this forever, but I want to make sure that you know we have time to cover the thing.
April Snow: 22:37
This is really helpful because there's so many layers here. Right, and I appreciate the underlying message to like ease in, test things along the way, reflect How's it going, make adjustments. Don't just take what you've been told or what the common dose is and you know we're kind of skirting around this issue. But I want to bring it more to the surface, which is HSPs often have different reactions to medication, to supplements, to treatments in general, so it's really important to listen to your body, to maybe start slow and then ramp up, yes, with whatever you're taking yes yes, yes, I am so, so, so important, and I've primarily focused my work, my naturopathic work, with on hsps for about 10 years.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 23:30
I've always done done it, but I wasn't exclusively HSP until the last 10 years and during this time, every time somebody comes and do I have ideas of how something might work out? I have ideas but ultimately it is their body that is going to dictate how quickly we go through. That is going to dictate how quickly we go through you know, any given protocol or what direction we take, and it's so, so critical that people HSPs specifically blank slate every time you start something new, blank slate as a beginner's mind, right, I know nothing about this and I am here to learn what my body has to tell me and then proceed Because, just because your neighbor, who's also an HSP, right, even within our own trait, you know we experience a lot of differences and that, I think, is the foundation of the medical empowerment that I hope that people HSPs start to experience with these types of messages.
April Snow: 24:38
Yes, empowerment is so important and I love that reminder. Your neighbor who's an HSP, your friend, your sister, whoever, even if they're doing this dose or taking this protocol, whatever it is, start from scratch what works for you. So in a naturopathics office, I imagine there's more conversation, there's more room, but what if you're getting a message from a practitioner that is more absolute, more regimented? Who's not thinking about a sensitive nervous system? What do you do then? So, as you're talking, I'm like this is amazing. This is exactly how I want to show up for my health, but I know not every practitioner is aware of sensitivity or is considering it.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 25:24
Yeah, yeah, I have a couple of thoughts about that. One is if you feel like your provider is constantly saying, well, it can't possibly be that, or you know, just kind of gaslit like your experience or what you are sharing is completely negated or invalidated, Then at that point I would say I would highly encourage that somebody find a different provider. And this can happen in the functional world, it can happen in the naturopathic world. I have worked with colleagues and professors who were very rigid about how they thought something you know, a protocol, should be executed and I have something to say about that. But to finish the first section, if you feel that you are invalidated and not heard, I think that's the key If you feel heard with a provider and they say your situation is very extreme and you're suffering a lot, and I strongly recommend that we do it this way and if things go sideways, then we can reevaluate. There's a dialogue.
April Snow: 26:34
Yep, they're actually hearing your experience. They're not shut off to it.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 26:39
Yes, yep, so that's a very important sign. If you are not feeling heard, I feel like that is detrimental to your health. So forget about the fact that you know you haven't even started the treatment right that I think healing spaces in. As a therapist, you know you understand the relationship is the primary vehicle for healing, and that is no different in the medical world.
April Snow: 27:07
No, it's the foundation. You have to have that in place before anything else happens. No, it's the foundation. You have to have that in place before anything else happens, completely agree.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 27:16
So that's one perspective. If that doesn't feel, if you aren't even at neutral right, like if you're starting off neutral and it's not an amazing relationship, that can still work. But if there's a sense of invalidation or medical gaslighting, I do think that that is more problematic. It's adding to the imbalance that you're there to receive help with. So I would say find a new provider. If you're dealing with something that is really disruptive to your life, right, and you are in a lot of pain, like there is something that is prohibiting you from being able to engage in work or family or just quality of life, then it's possible that a more robust protocol may be in order. And then at that point, if you're working with someone who came really highly recommended, it might be an exception. You know, to everything has to be a conversation, but I would still really emphasize the importance of feeling heard.
April Snow: 28:21
Yeah, that's, I mean, essential right, and maybe you're varying the degrees of being heard or what you feel is enough. If there's other circumstances, it sounds like that has to be there, at least in some level. Yeah.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 28:34
I think so, without adding toxicity right to a difficult situation. Having said that, I think most sensitive people can find providers that hear them, you know, and I think maybe even if somebody is going through something really complicated, like a complex autoimmune condition or something that's not diagnosed yet but is debilitating, maybe it's even more important in those circumstances to find somebody to work with you, because it's oftentimes those cases that are most sensitive to medications and supplements and vitamins and herbs and all of that, and so they need extra care to not feel worse.
April Snow: 29:15
Yes, they really do. You're talking about autoimmune and energy levels. Are we destined for these things, as HSPs Burnout, sleep issues, autoimmune issues, digestive issues? Because you see a lot of HSP struggling with these issues.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 29:35
Yeah, I do think that we have a very significant susceptibility to complex health pictures or burnout symptoms or some of these health concerns that we're talking about, because we process the world as deeply as we do and every experience of sensory data requires a chemical reaction.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 30:02
So if we, you know, if we see light more brightly or hear sounds more intensely or emotions more intensely, depending on what your sensitivity is or, in some cases like myself, all of the above, you know, each of those is a chemical reaction and those chemical reactions require nutrients and they require extra detoxification and a lot of energy to run those chemical reactions and replenish the nutrients.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 30:33
Once again, I like to think of it as baking a cake. So if you bake one cake, you need your eggs and your oil and your water and then you need the energy to bake it and then the experience of the cake, right? So the emotion, the sadness or whatever. Or if it's a lot of sadness, then it's 10 cakes. You know that you're baking. Then you got to go back and clean the kitchen that's the detoxification piece and restock your pantry. So these are elements that go into physiological self-care for sensitive person that you know a non-HSP doesn't have to think about they make one cake, maybe five in a day, right, like we're like cake, cake, cake, cake, cake, cake cake you know this little right, just a hamster wheel of cake making.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 31:19
Yes, a hamster wheel of cake making, yeah, and so they can just eat their regular diet. They can go about. You know, they're 80% of the population's self-care, which is just existing really, you know. And everything their pantry gets restocked, everything gets cleaned up and they don't have to think twice about it. But we have a very different internal cellular experience. So that makes it more susceptible to answer.
April Snow: 31:48
No, this is making so much sense because I always think about how much emotional energy we take from processing our experiences. I haven't extended that thing about we need more nutrients or physiological support Because, right, if we're having all these different chemical reactions in our brain doing all this processing, our brains are more lit up, taking in all this information. Of course our body is going to need to pull that energy from somewhere, and if we're depleted on that level, other systems start to be impacted. Yes, exactly so. It's not that we're necessarily susceptible or weak. Yes, Physiologically, it's that we need a different level of input.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 32:29
It seems very just basic we need a different level of input. It seems very just basic.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 32:36
Yeah Right, it's not weakness, it's not a deficit, it's not I was born to be ill or I was born to be not well, it's, I was born to be cared for in a very different way than 80% of the population, and whether or not we had HSP parents, you know we're just now at a place that I'm able to change the story for my son. But my parents, who one, was kind of an HSP, but you know, an officer in the military, like right, he's going to be the one to teach me. I mean, poor man, like so disconnected from his own needs as a sensitive person. So it's very common for, you know, those of us in the certainly 30s and 40s and beyond to not have had any kind of guidance because they didn't know. They didn't know, yeah, yeah, Even the self-care right of how very empowering to shift that mindset and just as, I think, just as empowering as learning.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 33:56
Oh my gosh. This is a trait that benefits communities. You know that has helped societies to thrive and to survive. So is this understanding of the physical piece that our bodies are just doing more and so they just bring care. That's it.
April Snow: 34:14
It's that basic Different body, different level of care Right, and it is something that our parents had no clue about, right? I mean, mental health in general was not even on the radar, let alone looking at temperament and nervous system wiring and just these physiological needs. So this is a good reminder that we need to take care of our physical needs, so then we can take our emotional needs and we can show up for that purpose for our communities, because we do have a very specific reason to be here. You know, this trait has survived, however long, for a reason Exactly. Yeah, so just to and there's some noise outside, I apologize for listeners, just trying to take in what you're saying because it's such an important message. So if we want to feel our best, we want to actually have energy, we want to give ourselves a buffer against that almost seems like a never burnout. What are some of the basics that?
Dr. Karen Lamb: 35:18
we should be doing? Would you say we talked about nutritional supplementation? What else would you put on that list? So before I go through some of this list, I just want to make a blanket statement that very gentle and simple things go a really, really long way for sensitive people. So this might sound too basic or oversimplified, but sensitive people most often thrive with the most minimal and natural interventions. Is that always the case? No, I certainly am not here to preach that natural approaches are always the answer for sensitive people. Absolutely not Integrative. Use all the tools you know, but start super, super basic and as natural as possible and then go from there.
April Snow: 36:03
I mean it's such a good reminder because we are more emotionally perceptive, visually perceptive. I think our bodies are also more perceptive and just soak up whatever we're giving it like a sponge. Yes, yeah, start small.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 36:16
Yes, yes, we have a very narrow window of optimal functioning and you know that can feel really frustrating when you're the sensitive person, and maybe even to providers that are not, you know, compassionate of that experience, because that's where medical gaslighting comes into play. We know we're outside of this little window and so we're like something's not right. I don't feel well, I gotta talk to somebody. Then they go talk to somebody and they're like your labs are perfect. So we have such a fantastic tool within us that is so advanced that modern day science most of modern day science, certainly conventional labs cannot identify what we are feeling, and so we're great candidates for preventative medicine because of that.
April Snow: 37:08
I mean truly, because we can detect something before it shows up on the scan, on the blood test. So I think there's a room there to remind folks that self-advocate right, find that provider that will listen to you. Like something feels off, because I've had that too where, oh, my labs are all perfect, I'm like, but something is wrong. I'm having inflammation. I need a closer look and that's why I went outside of the traditional system to receive medical care.
April Snow: 37:36
And yeah, just a reminder that you know listen to yourself. But also the small, subtle intervention might be enough.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 37:45
Yes.
April Snow: 37:45
And we're really looking outside the box here in every way. Yes.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 37:50
And, if it's still present, keep bringing it up. If you keep bringing it up to a provider and they get frustrated or start invalidating you when maybe they didn't at first, it's time for somebody new, because the right provider is always going to say we need to keep digging, we need to keep looking until we find that answer. If you feel like you're burdening someone or don't go into the people pleasing, say okay, thank you, we've done our work. It's time to find somebody else.
April Snow: 38:19
This is not the time to people, please Right, absolutely not. Yes, because I've heard so many HSPs share that they caught something a major medical issue early before their providers would have caught it.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 38:33
Absolutely yes, a hundred percent, trust yourself. Yes, so to answer your question, I just wanted to make a disclaimer. You know that this might sound really basic, but just beginner's mind, right, once again, beginner's mind. So, my, there's lots of elements, there's many different ways to optimize hydration, but the reason that it's so important and I like to include this because my mom used to tell me from a very young age you need to drink more water, which is interesting because now I'm thinking, oh wow, she was teaching me how to take care of my age needs but I found it so frustrating because I really like to understand why, and I didn't feel thirsty, so it was weird to me.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 39:22
And so once I really understood, you know, going back to that cake analogy, I have to go back and clean the kitchen. So after each chemical reaction, after each cake that I bake, which is constantly there, needs to be enough water, because that's the most basic form of cleaning our bodies, to get the kitchen ready for my next sensory experience. And so there you can understand why HSPs have a high requirement for water. And it's not just drinking the water, it's getting the water into the cells and you know, electrolytes are important in that process toxicity, mitochondrial function. There's other elements of that, but just bare bones. Most basic recommendation is hydration.
April Snow: 40:08
This makes a lot of sense because I drink a lot of water every day, but there's a sense of I feel like I'm dehydrated, like my wife is. She's not a big water drinker and I was, like you know, I'm drinking water all day long, from time I wake up till I go to bed, and it's like, okay, this makes sense because I'm thinking about how the brain cleans itself while you sleep, but I hadn't really thought about how your body is needing to do that, detoxing all day long. And what's the vehicle for that? It's water. Yes, needs to flush through and the more water I force myself to drink more water and my digestion is better, my energy is better. Like I notice a difference.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 40:50
Yes, yes, it was surprising In the energy module of the program, of the Thriving Sensitivity Program. That is the first thing that I talk about under energy, because almost all people wish they could have more.
April Snow: 41:04
That makes sense.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 41:05
Yes, yes, all right, and I too, you know, I'm drinking water constantly and it's like I mean, the demand is so high and I live at altitude, so that just adds a whole, a whole other element of complexity. But it's so critical and it's so basic and understanding. I hope that explaining it in that way is helpful for those sensitive people out there like myself who really like to understand why am I doing this? So hydration, first and foremost, and I love what you said about regeneration and healing of detoxification of the brain and the body during sleep. Dehydration can cause sleep disruptions, because if you don't have the water, you know the cleaning supplies then you end up waking or not having very restful sleep, because the whole purpose of sleep is to detoxify and regenerate tissue. So if you don't have the necessary tools to do that, it's not going to feel restful. So that's the next thing that I was going to mention is optimizing your sleep, and that's definitely sounds much easier than it is right. I mean, it's a checkbox, but it's a whole process underneath it that we oftentimes do best when we collaborate with a provider that can help to use a scientific method to help go through what's working, what's not, systematically.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 42:34
Bowel movements are another thing to keep track of. Regular, easy, uneventful, fully formed bowel movements at least once a day. Every time our digestive tract turns on it is moving all the way through from mouth to out. So if you're eating a meal then technically we should be moving another meal out. So some people feel best when they have three bowel movements, but my absolute minimum for everyone is once a day. So if you're not having a bowel movement at least once a day, that's a form of constipation, even if every other day it's an easy bowel movement. So people think of constipation as it needing to be difficult to pass or dry. It doesn't necessarily have to be that. It's more about how frequently are you removing waste from your body, because the longer it stays in your intestines the toxins get reabsorbed back in and that just puts extra burden on your body to have to do the same thing twice or three times.
April Snow: 43:36
It makes sense, right, as things come in, they should go out. Yes, yeah, feels pretty simple. So we have in, they should go out. Yes, yeah, it feels pretty simple.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 43:50
So we have hydration, sleep, bowel movements, anything else that feels essential to focus on. I mean, those are really super basic and important, and I would encourage people to take their time with this. So that's one of the things that I really like really pride myself, and I had. I saw somebody this morning and she said I'm such a bad patient. I didn't do anything that we talked about, and the first thing I said to her was absolutely not, there are no bad patients. It's that we didn't identify your needs accurately and because of that, we didn't make a plan that was actionable for you, and so that's very important. With these three things that we just discussed, it's you know our brain can think oh, they're so simple, I should be able to incorporate them quickly, and that is a disservice to your process, especially as sensitive people, right? So, starting with something as simple as adding two extra ounces of water, starting by measuring the water that you're consuming and then adding two extra ounces and slowly building up to what's ideal for you that makes sense.
April Snow: 44:56
Start small, something that you can actually accomplish, instead of putting all the pressure to do all the things at once, cause, yes, sleep and digestion are pretty foundational, but those are big mountains to climb, depending on what's going on. But, starting with hydration, could impact both.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 45:16
Yes, yes, and sleep especially. I mean sleep is notoriously complex. The only other thing I would add is trying to rely on food as much as possible for nutrients like vitamin C and magnesium. I'm not saying that supplementation, that there's anything wrong with supplementation, but there is a certain leverage that we get from food because food comes with the other nutrients that make it easier for those vitamins to be absorbed into function.
April Snow: 45:44
Yeah, so you get the whole package, whole package, all the components? Yeah, that you need to actually utilize those nutrients? Yeah, that makes sense. Well, karen, we're getting close to time, so I just want to see you know you've shared so many valuable pieces of information today and really, I think, widen the scope of how do we take care of ourselves as HSPs, how do we tap into the strengths of our sensitivity, the value that we bring. I just want to see if there's any final messages that you want to share.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 46:13
Definitely the burnout experience is solvable. You know, even if you're in that place of feeling really helpless or hopeless, there is nothing wrong with you. It's to be expected that, given the wear and tear, as we've discussed today on our sensitive bodies, that burnout without very specific intervention is. I mean it sounds daunting but it's almost inevitable for all of us as HSPs. I mean it certainly has been my experience, and so just knowing that you know tuning your instrument as an HSP requires special knowledge that we just it hasn't been given to us and it is available for us and especially finding that right practitioner can make a world of difference.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 46:59
I think that's a really important message because I hope that sensitive people can start to fine tune their instruments, because I feel like our world, more than ever at least it feels that way in my lifetime is in need of our beautiful melodies, right that our tuned instruments can play.
Dr. Karen Lamb: 47:21
So that's really an important message and that's why I developed the Thriving Sensitivity Program is to systematically present these things in actionable steps in ways that feel digestible and run the gamut from, you know, interpreting conventional labs and specialty labs and really being able to feel empowered in our own health, because even though there are providers that can help. It is always my goal in working with sensitive people to get them to a place where they become their own doctors, with some guidance and some adjustment, always knowing that they can come back. But the idea is we have all of the information inside. We just need that practitioner information of oh well, what test is it or what nutrient is it and how do I assess that? And that was my goal with the Thriving Sensitivity Program is for people sensitive people to feel empowered with their health and learn how to do that in a manageable, digestible way.
April Snow: 48:24
I love that, because so many clients that I work with are trying to do that but not having the guidance, the resources or the understanding of being able to put that clinician hat on, because we really are so gifted at knowing what our bodies need that we can really heal ourselves. And you're right that we are all susceptible to burnout just because of the way our bodies function and the world that we live in and that mismatch. But there's a lot we can do to actually find that balance and we can actually thrive. I just love that that's the word you put into the program the thriving sensitivity, because it's true, I think we think those two are opposite, but they can. You know, sensitivity and thriving can coexist. So I'll be sure to share that link in the show notes for folks who are looking for that support. Also, share your social media, your website and the quiz as well. Yeah, so I just want to thank you?
Dr. Karen Lamb: 49:20
Yeah, the 15% discount for anybody who puts that in. I think I can share that code if I haven't already.
April Snow: 49:28
Perfect and I'll make sure I share that in our outro so we folks can have that Wonderful. Thank you so much, karen. Thanks so much for joining me and Karen for today's conversation. What I hope you take away is that you are the expert on your own body and your own health. Trust your intuition and find providers that will listen. If you're struggling with burnout, head to thrivingsensitivitycom for Karen's sensitivity burnout quiz and courses. Links are in the show notes. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to the Sensitive Stories podcast so you don't miss our upcoming conversations. Reviews and ratings are also helpful and appreciated For behind-the-scenes content and more HSP resources. You can sign up for my email list or follow Sensitive Strengths on Instagram, tiktok and YouTube. Check out the show notes or sensitivestoriescom for all the resources from today's episode. Thanks for listening.
