61: Breaking the Cycle of Self-Sacrifice
With Angelique Foye-Fletcher, LMFT, RPT
How often do you take care of yourself? In this episode, I talk with Angelique Foye-Fletcher, LMFT, RPT about breaking the cycle of self-sacrifice and:
• How your cultural upbringing shapes your identity as an HSP
• Learning to take care of yourself when you grew up in an environment or culture that didn’t have room for your sensitivity
• Why simple acts of mindfulness are deeply healing and can change the way you parent
Angelique Foye-Fletcher (she/her) is a Licensed Marriage & Family Therapist and Registered Play Therapist who helps sensitive, neurodivergent adults and caregivers heal through her four pillars of Books, Nature, Play, and Connection. An INFJ, HSP, and Enneagram 4, Angelique brings curiosity, ritual, and deep empathy into her work—often lighting incense or walking in nature as part of her own healing practice.
Keep in touch with Angelique:
• Website: https://foyefletchertherapy.com
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/foyefletchertherapy
• TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@foyefletcherllc
Resources Mentioned:
• Parent/Caregiver Support: https://foyefletchertherapy.com/parentcaregiver-support-coaching
• Reconnect + Rejuvenate Support: https://foyefletchertherapy.com/coachingtherapy-packages
Thanks for listening!
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This episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Some links are affiliate links. You are under no obligation to purchase any book, product or service. I am not responsible for the quality or satisfaction of any purchase.
Episode Transcript
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 0:00
When we think about the term cycle breaker, it's being able to recognize that just because this happened to this person, this person, this person doesn't mean it stops here and full stop. And that means also, literally, like undoing the work, firing the brain, reestablishing a sense of clarity and connectedness to self, unapologetically.
April Snow: 0:37
Welcome to Sensitive Stories, the podcast for the people who live with hearts and eyes wide open. I'm your host, psychotherapist and author, april Snow. I invite you to join me as I deep dive into rich conversations with fellow highly sensitive people that will inspire you to live a more fulfilling life as an HSP without all the overwhelm. In this episode I talk with Angelique Foyer-Fletcher about learning to take care of yourself when you grew up in an environment or culture that didn't have room for your sensitivity. Why simple acts of mindfulness are deeply healing and learning to ask yourself the question what do I need now? Marriage and family therapist and registered play therapist who helps sensitive, nor divergent adult and caregivers heal through her four pillars of books, nature, play and connection. As an INFJ, hsp and Enneagram 4, angelique brings curiosity, ritual and deep empathy into her work, often lighting incense or walking in nature as part of her own healing practice.
April Snow: 1:43
For more HSP resources and to see behind-the-scenes video from the podcast, join me on Instagram, tiktok or YouTube at Sensitive Strengths or sign up for my email list. Links are in the show notes and at sensitivestoriescom. And just a reminder that this episode is for educational purposes only and is not intended as a substitute for treatment with a mental health or medical professional. Let's dive in. Angelique, I'm so happy to have you on the podcast. Thank you, it's really exciting. Thank you so much for being here.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 2:33
Yes, I'm happy to be here. Yes.
April Snow: 2:35
Me too, so excited to talk with you, and I wonder if we could start off where we start off every episode, which is looking at your HSP discovery story. I'd love to hear how or when you realize that you're highly sensitive.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 2:49
What a great question. So how did I discover being an HSP? It all started in high school. When you know, like many of us, we want to know who are we?
April Snow: 2:58
What are we?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 2:58
You know what I mean, and so I would take a lot of personality tests. I was 15, 16, like. What am I? And I'm like is my introvert? Extrovert? That was very big MBTI, myers-briggs. And along the way I noticed like I've always heard the term very sensitive as well, but as more of a deficit, but that would keep coming up in my personality tests, or having sensitivity towards just my thought process and my emotions, and then it wasn't until I was about 28. So about eight, six, seven years ago I just said wait, there's this thing called H is highly sensitive, empath Instagram. Everyone was talking about it and I'm like I think that's me, so that's my process.
April Snow: 3:46
Yeah, it's true, you have this awareness before you have the term. And there's that seeking. I resonate with that so much. What's different about me? Why am I so sensitive? You're seeking right, trying to figure it out and I've heard that word too a lot Deficit or difference.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 4:03
Different. Yeah, too much All the labels, tough enough thick skin. I'm like, okay, what about just feeling the vibes in the room? Yeah, that's a strength, picking up on the things that no one can feel and see.
April Snow: 4:17
It's a huge strength. I don't think people realize the benefit of that. I think they take advantage of the benefits.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 4:23
Yes.
April Snow: 4:24
Without actually realizing what's happening. They love our emotional connection and empathy. They love all that part, unless it's until it gets maybe inconvenient for them.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 4:35
Correct.
April Snow: 4:36
Man, you really you're on it. It's like this part is oh, there's so many beautiful overlaps with whoever I talk to and it's just really beautiful to see. Oh, we all have a somewhat similar roots or journey. Yeah. So I wonder if we could dive in a little bit more deeply. You mentioned your emotional sensitivity. I'm wondering how your upbringing, your cultural upbringing, has shaped that, shaped your identity as an HSP.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 5:06
Absolutely for you because absolutely shaped that, shaped your identity as an hsp absolutely. I remember in grads I have to start with kind of this term we call location of self. So I'm a licensed marriage family therapist and I learned this term in grad school back in 2017 at purdue, where they said, okay, you have to locate yourself, knowing your privileges, your what, all the identities that are marginalized or historically oppressed, if you will. But I had the opposite effect.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 5:29
Right April I actually had a lot of deep-rooted connection as a Ghanaian American so my mother is from Ghana, so West Africa region or Nigeria, and I grew up with the food, the culture, the language, all those kinds of things right that gave me a sense of pride, gave me a sense of belonging that really resonated with me and helped me feel grounded. However, I also grew up as a Black child in the South, where there's many folks from similar populations who we look every skin full of ancient kinfolk, as we say, who actually see as okay. I have a disconnect because of the historical oppression and racism and all the things right, Not tied to my I don't know that part of me, but because you're different from me. That's when there's always that disconnect, that feeling of othering, if you will.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 6:24
And then I grew up in small town Kansas, so add that in when Midwest is very much about being meek, mild, quiet.
April Snow: 6:33
Yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 6:34
Don't be too loud. And that was always just a hard journey, hard space. Because, as a Gunnian American who's very rooted in being jovialvial, loud, very family oriented, very education oriented those are I can locate myself going back to that term, locate myself as a gunning American, growing up in the Midwest with Midwestern and Southern roots that was also deeply influenced by inferior and superior racialized inferiority going on.
April Snow: 7:08
Anyway, it feels like you're getting oh gosh, these beautiful Ghanian roots, but then you're getting pulled away from that who you really are, and I just think about it.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 7:18
Where do I fit? Where do you?
April Snow: 7:19
fit Exactly and that could have been really beautiful if you could live in that as an HSP, getting to feel your big joy. I don't know how emotions are viewed or sensitivity is viewed, but I could just imagine you could take up some space maybe versus putting yourself in this little tiny box.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 7:34
You bring up an interesting point, april. It was funny because it's not that. I was actually the quiet, sensitive, shy, reserved. Oh, she has a voice but she's not using it. Always getting that in the classroom.
April Snow: 7:50
Yep.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 7:51
Where my culture is the opposite. Again, loud, brazen, bold all that kind of thing. And I just wasn't able to hone in on that. Yeah, or dare I say, being encouraged or supported.
April Snow: 8:03
I feel like you could have filled up that space. What stops you? Is it being in the environment you're in? Is it family? Is it teachers in the classroom? What stops?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 8:13
you.
April Snow: 8:13
Yeah, if you're open to sharing that.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 8:16
Absolutely. When I look back on my experience, what always stopped me was I was almost discouraged to. I was encouraged to have a voice, but make sure it fits my voice. Make sure it fits doesn't, because I was blunt as well. So, as an INFJ the one percenters, everybody out there I'll just you know, whatever it is.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 8:39
I'm just like okay, I never had, I had the capacity to. I had this deep internal world, really like getting lost in there, loving kind of the narratives and all that kind of stuff, but my emotions and my brain sometimes would just feel like a scramble, and so when teachers would see me zoning out, yep I was a good kid because I wasn't talking.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 9:02
Yep yeah, people pleasing all that kind of stuff, my trauma-responsive fawning. Because guess what? There were some abandonment wounds, some rejection wounds that I experienced early on in my childhood that even just having a deep-rooted identity with being Gunnian wasn't enough to feel seen, if that makes sense.
April Snow: 9:28
Makes total sense. The sensitive quiet ones get labeled the good kid, when, yes, we're quiet on the outside but there's a storm happening inside and you need space for that and to be able to take those emotions somewhere for someone to check in what's happening in there, what's going on under that quiet facade and sometimes quiet.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 9:45
We're naturally quiet, but sometimes we're quiet because we're shut down true, I don't know the difference sometimes, yeah yeah, it all looks the same yeah, and when you have a parent who's not as present with their own emotions because they got a single parent, you got to take care of the kids. A household yeah, I'm overwhelmed, but then I'm also like my kid is fine, I live with my sister. They're playing in the room quietly. But I'm also like I need to be outside of nature.
April Snow: 10:13
You were needing things to feed your kind of sensitive soul. Your INFJ personality.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 10:19
And it was just. It was like few and far inconsistent.
April Snow: 10:21
You're not getting that nourishment. Yeah, yeah, it's tough. I didn't have the same experience at all, but I can resonate a lot with the quietly suffering or being the good one in the chaos and okay, we don't need to worry about you, but there's things that you need right To just satisfy that depth and that connection and like the strong emotionality. You also said that you're blunts naturally, which I always get excited about.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 10:47
Yes, hsps can be blunts, we can be outspoken yes, that was always a I say it with justin funny now, but growing up I heard that so much like angela, she's great, she's nice, she's fun and she can be really blunt. Yeah, but you say it in that sometimes you just kind of ah. So I would wear my emotions on my sleeve. And again, my thought process was disjointed because, think about it, I grew up, also grew up. I didn't tell you this, but I had German roots as well. So through transracial adoption, grandma, whatever, yeah, she was spoke different languages. So I had two people in my household who didn't, whose first language was in english.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 11:27
So the thought pattern, the connection, there's, yep, some disjointedness there so then my thought process was hard sometimes to say what am I feeling versus what am I thinking, and I just would say it yeah, you're trying to process it out loud.
April Snow: 11:43
Perhaps I was a what they say external processor.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 11:44
Yes. Yeah, that makes sense. Just trying to process it out loud, perhaps I was a. It was an external processor.
April Snow: 11:46
Yes, yeah, that makes sense, just trying to put all the pieces together. But then I've heard this from a lot of hsps, especially hsps who come from cultures that are more outspoken, maybe more extroverted, where they feel like, oh, I can't be my sensitive self and be this, maybe blunt, outspoken or external processor, like those pieces maybe don't fit, even though they could fit it's just it's every difference should be embraced.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 12:11
What you should acknowledge like there's there's nothing about the sense of healthy confrontation. That's something that I that's a term I learned when I was taking the clinical exam, I want to say last year, and it was very interesting. I was like healthy confrontation, what is that? That's what I thought I was doing with other people when they would get in my space or I'm overloaded or whatever, and then I'm like I want to share with you, but then I didn't have any boundaries set up uh you know what I mean.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 12:37
People get away with talking crazy and then I reach my limit and it goes out. What's different with?
April Snow: 12:42
bound. If you have a boundary set up, how does that become different for you? Just for folks who may not be familiar with that yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 12:50
So how I look at it is like boundaries. It's like your house, right, and there's a fence around your house and you have three different types of fences. Either you have a wooden fence, where people can see, overlook, but they know not to get near, but there's a gate. The second one there's a gate open, but there's a gate. The second one is a gate open, but there's no lock. Anyone can come in anytime. It's there Like a porous boundary. If you will, you allow the boundary to happen. You don't. You set the boundary, but you still let it happen.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 13:14
And then, the last one is just a fortress, this large, big thing that covers the whole house. No one can get in, and so, for a long time, how I would define boundaries is just knowing that this is me loving you and loving me at the same time. Yes, this is letting you know. This is where I draw the line here, this is where I recognize that I can't be in the space Like what you're saying, what you're doing to me, is affecting, kind of our connection, and so this is me lovingly confronting you, yes, and letting you know that this is the fence, this is protected property.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 13:48
And to ensure our friendship, co-worker relationship, romantic relationship, whatever. It's important to establish that, and sometimes you have to shift those boundaries.
April Snow: 13:58
Yeah, they can be. They can change Right Person to person moment to moment.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 14:04
But they have to be established and it's not the job of the person. Toxic people typically will feel entitled to ignore it. Dr Adam Grant said that he's a great IO psychologist. Toxic people typically feel entitled to ignore your boundaries, where healthy people know that they need to maintain the boundaries, and I just that resonated with me as a HSP. Yeah, and recognizing the space that I want to provide for others.
April Snow: 14:27
Boundaries are just part of relationships. I think some people interpret them as distance or a problem, but it's really just keeping the relationship healthy balanced Right.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 14:39
Balanced yes.
April Snow: 14:41
Exactly, and we need to be able to confront people. I think HSP struggle with that a lot. We're afraid of confrontation of conflict.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 14:47
Yeah, I was guilty of that. Yeah, Same.
April Snow: 14:50
But I've seen just how it actually strengthens a relationship, right, because if you're not fighting, ooh, things are festering.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 15:01
Yes, that's right yeah, yes. Yeah, so you've had quite the healing journey yourself.
April Snow: 15:09
it sounds like really reflecting on your early years as a sensitive child and adolescent, and then bringing that into focus of what, what was going on and how, the cultural elements in which greatly influence our experience of sensitivity. So I'm wondering how does that influence you now?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 15:25
supporting others, yes, yeah so currently in my life, right now, I am just have the privilege and honor to be a mother of two beautiful children, and I'm a wife of a wonderful civil servant so I'll just keep it at that. He works for the city and we both have high stress jobs in a sense of, and also where we're at in our family life cycle of parenting two young kids under four.
April Snow: 15:52
Oh yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 15:53
And I'm married to an introvert. He's an. I'm an introvert. Yeah, I have put a lot.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 16:00
How I show up for others is making sure that I pour into myself at home. This is me. I think about it as, and it's been off and on. Sometimes it's like I overextend myself, over-function, as it happens, because sometimes the body just does, the body does the thing, and sometimes it slows down. I had to learn the hard lesson, right. But how I show up for others is being able to pour a water can into myself like a plant, right At home, right. Others is being able to pour a water can into myself like a plant right at home, right.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 16:26
I myself am an indoor plant. I need sunlight, right. I need to be outside, I need to have oxygen, so breathing right, being present, being mindful and creating a structure and environment, a home where it's just safe to be. Yeah, like when you're growing up with two different homes Louisiana here, kansas there. This home is parented this way, this home is parented this way. You just you don't ever really have a standard grounded. It's like growing up in a divorced family, like there's just different rules apply differently and you don't know what to expect. So I work with a lot of clients like that. Who?
April Snow: 17:04
are trying, who have been disjointed, or trying to navigate two different worlds at the same time? Yeah, it's a very tough transition for an HSP.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 17:14
And yeah, you're right. And so as far as, like being a mother before I became a mom, I recognized I have to heal. First start that healing journey. So then it's not harder for them to feel like they have to recover from childhood, Because childhood can be difficult, no matter what the best intentions. Sometimes you just will make mistakes. But if you can be open to building upon knowing that maybe there is some work that I need to do, the reparenting piece- yeah, setting up structure for myself?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 17:50
Absolutely yeah, so then I can show up for my clients and not be burnt out and take it out on them, take it out on my family at home. This is not fair, it's not right, it's not fair.
April Snow: 18:00
Your childhood is inherently stressful. It's a lot of development that's happening and inner exploration, but you can create a stronger foundation for your kids than what you had of grounded steadiness, yeah, and so does this. I think this stems into your work with cycle breakers, would you say, and could you tell folks a little bit about what that is? I think we've already alluded to it, but if we could define it for folks who maybe haven't heard that term before, Absolutely. Thank you.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 18:32
When we think about the term cycle breaker, it's being able to recognize that when I just had brunch with a friend of mine, a girlfriend of mine, who said it's not generational curses you're trying to break, it's in generational trauma right. The trauma wounds. It's you saying, it's someone saying just because this happened to this person doesn't mean that it gets. Stops here, okay and full stop. And that means also literally like undoing the work, firing the brain, reestablishing a sense of clarity and connectedness to self, unapologetically.
April Snow: 19:17
Love that.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 19:19
Yeah.
April Snow: 19:20
I just think about this kind of just putting up a dam right and redirecting the river, like we can go in a different direction from here. We don't have to continue these intergenerational patterns that we inherited, because that's what it is, it's patterns.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 19:38
It's patterns, dare I say almost, because there wasn't like consistent patterns. It's like I have to fill in the gap and recognize. Okay, if you grew up in a home where it was chaotic and confusing and unpredictable right so somewhere along the way you had to learn to be aware of when daddy's mood is off or be understanding of some tension there.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 19:59
But now you're a grown person in your own house and you still feel keyed up and on edge. Maybe you didn't put pictures in the house because you don't feel like it's feel a connectedness to it. But you can cycle. Breaking is not just this radical. Do all the MDR sessions. It helps. I'm not going to lie. It will accelerate. Yeah, it's not. It's not everything. It's not everything, yeah.
April Snow: 20:21
And you frame a good point. If you grew up feeling on edge, scared, have to be hypervigilant to whatever's happening and read the room at all times, yeah, that doesn't just fade away as soon as you move into your own space, you're carrying those ghosts with you. And gosh, even just the piece about hanging up the pictures I remember reading this. There's a book about the nervous system. It was like people that grew up in those conditions we just don't know how to live. That resonated with me a lot. Yeah, not doing simple things like settling into a space hanging up a photo, because what if you have to leave sooner?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 20:54
Yep.
April Snow: 20:54
You're on edge, but that can change, doing the work and, yeah, giving yourself permission to, or maybe acknowledging that you're safe in your own home, acknowledging, but you have to understand, define safety and security. Different for everybody, and I had to do that. Yeah, yeah, do you want to say more about how you did that?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 21:22
Taylor Thomas and this amazing comedian female comedian like in her mid twenties, I've been sure people know from the audience. She talked about how the twenties are you're expected to fuck up.
April Snow: 21:32
Yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 21:32
Like people expect you to mess up, fuck up and so that resonated with me in the saying okay, so I had permission, like looking back in my twenties, looking like doing all the things permission like looking back in my twenties looking like doing all the things, like going out to clubs when I don't know it, that's not my style.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 21:46
I was a very sensory overload living with roommates when I don't like living with people I don't really genuinely care about. You know what I'm saying. That's to blunt me saying I just don't. I have this allergic reaction to being in an environment where it's too loud, too smelly, too many people, and yet I just kept going yeah, what you's supposed to do, you're supposed to do. The fear of FOMO was real and at the same time it was learning. It was input, learning input. But again, your frontal lobe ain't lobing. Yep, not yet. So it was like, yes, I wish someone would have told me like I expect you to make mistakes and fuck up and learn along the way, but then don't make too big of a mistake.
April Snow: 22:26
Yep.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 22:27
Because redirect the path. It's this way.
April Snow: 22:30
You don't have the privilege to mess up so much.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 22:33
Exactly so. It's just always all gas no tank. All gas, no brakes. I should say I'm in my 20s and I just recognize like I have to just slow down, be intentional, and that looks like defining what security, stability looks like redefining it for myself, and some folks who might be listening might be saying what does she mean by that? I get that Because you're like go chat to BT and you're like security is this you're like go chat to bt and you're like security, is this right, you could?
April Snow: 23:07
there's a standard definition, but yeah, it's different. How would you be able to share maybe one example of what security means for?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 23:12
you. I think it's an idea. I would say an example of that for myself. How it presents is like being able to say I'm okay.
April Snow: 23:27
Yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 23:29
I'm safe, I'm loved, I'm okay.
April Snow: 23:33
Yeah, wow, and that's true. Maybe it wasn't before.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 23:41
Buddhist principle would say yes no, maybe we don't know. We don't know why things happen the way they do. Yes, maybe there's a reason, maybe, and there's this really great Japanese author I'm don't got the name, but he wrote a lot on the male loneliness pandemic back in way back in the epidemic, I should say back in the late 80s and he talked about. He said pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.
April Snow: 24:05
Oh, did not hon.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 24:06
Yeah, yes, and that resonated with me so much, because cycle breaking is saying the life is of pain and it's inevitable. Right the suffering, the internal struggles, the not recognizing that you need a release and to let go of guilt and understand that what happened as a kid was not OK.
April Snow: 24:29
Yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 24:29
Or that maybe the adults in your life didn't have what they needed to make sure that you're OK, safe, secure. But you get to do that. Work now, not too late. To do that work now, not too late, not too late. And it just starts by just having the courage to still live a life worth living.
April Snow: 24:49
Yeah, that's hopeful, like, even if it was hard before, it was hard yesterday, you still have time to find that safety, to say to yourself I'm okay, I'm safe here. Even if I wasn't safe then, yeah, oh yeah, that's powerful.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 25:12
It's just as simple as saying because when you ask me like security, because I'm still on that journey of okay, I know that if I can say there's a little part, there's a little, there's little, me saying am I okay? And big me saying you are, I'm here. The four therapeutic powers of play says I am here, I see you, I feel you, I see you. So those are the things I see you, I hear you, I feel you, I am here. That's what play is about To yourself.
April Snow: 25:40
I guess as an adult you could say it to yourself, but as a play therapist, are you saying it to the kiddos?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 25:44
you're working with. Yeah, beautiful, yes.
April Snow: 25:48
I love that, so I'm here. I see you. Yeah, I'm safe.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 25:52
I am here.
April Snow: 25:53
I am here. Yeah, it's so simple but so powerful and, like you said, it's a starting to rewire those messages right, Reframe the messages, rewire your brain towards safety. So in your work as a play therapist and as a parent, I'm curious what practices do you bring in for the adults in those scenarios? You use a lot of mindfulness, grounding practices. You mentioned finding that safe, grounded space at home. What does that look like? What?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 26:23
are some of those practices. Oh yeah, as far as with my clients, yeah, or yourself or myself.
April Snow: 26:30
yeah, for the sensitive cycle breakers out there who are wondering what are the practices that I'm talking to myself differently but are there other things that I'm bringing in?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 26:39
Oh, beautiful question. It's practical. But I'll go to my earlier thing of treat yourself like an indoor plant.
April Snow: 26:48
I love this metaphor or outdoor plant. What do they need? They?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 26:51
need lots of sunlight, so you need vitamin D Drink water. This is basic, but it's just those things, right.
April Snow: 26:59
Yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 27:00
Grounded. Go outside. That's what I like to do.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 27:03
I like to walk outside and feel my feet on the earth yep to feel a sense of connected to my ancestors, right, oil that they were on and being, gave me thanks and everything like that, as well as just walking. So movement is medicine, nature is medicine. And then being able to eat a nourishing meal, right, that looks like being more mindful of like anti-inflammatory diet, eating all the stuff that's colorful on my plate. That's healthy. Yeah, yeah, just. And I think, listening in, tuning in, tuning in to what I need, what is it that I need right now? For example, me having this conversation with you is very nourishing for me because it's my way of I'm able to connect to someone without having to over explain or just being.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 27:51
I set the space up for this, yeah, because it was an intention, it was an act. I wanted to make sure this is. These two things behind me are actually, you can see, here. Yeah, I don't know if they'll be able to see, but they're my what do you call it? From the Akan tribe. That's from where I'm from, and my mother got this from when she visited Ghana 30 years ago, and they are kente cloth, so her grandmother wore this, and so this is what's behind me to keep me rooted and grounded.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 28:22
And then, in the middle, is my family, an multicultural family me being married to an expat, my mom, my gunny, my British family, all the things you know.
April Snow: 28:31
That's so beautiful.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 28:35
These are your roots there in physical form.
April Snow: 28:43
So important to have those symbols, those connection points. And I appreciate what you're saying about these pieces that are medicine, because I think if you grew up in more of a chaotic or traumatic environment, I know from my own experience those simple things were hard or they didn't get to take space Hard to come by. So even just saying, what do I need now is a revelation, because that was a luxury growing up it was. So what do I need now is a revelation, because that was a luxury growing up it was.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 29:05
So what do I need now? What do I not deserve? What do I have to earn? My body is giving me signals and telling me that it's as simple as me lighting an incense. I remember in grad school I just started getting on the term of like self-care, because it's all the things stress and if you already come from a stressful environment, you're like, okay, I'm just throwing into it. But I was like, okay, I actually need to shift the gears here and understand what does that mean?
April Snow: 29:33
right.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 29:34
So I was making smoothies every day or being able to. Someone told me once, like my roommate, she said like I treated my room like a temple, which is like interesting. Because I was like what do you mean by that? Because I would have, I would light my incense grounding practice. Look at the smoke, let it dissipate you know what I mean.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 29:53
Read a book. Low lights, light a candle, love lighting candles, the Himalayan salt candles, the Himalayan salt, just even just my eyes able to see. Okay, this is soft and it's helping me re-engage into my senses and having my water on the side.
April Snow: 30:09
Yeah, I love this. Just the intentionality, taking care of your senses, your nervous system. But, deeper than that, having the rituals.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 30:17
I love that. Stability is routines rituals yes.
April Snow: 30:21
Routines and rituals R yes routines and rituals.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 30:23
Routines and rituals, rituals is not something that's like evil or whatever some stuff right. It's just this consistent routine that allows me to pour into myself, that regulates my nervous system that's it.
April Snow: 30:36
I think people get scared away by that term ritual, but it is just these, it's traditions, it's practices, right, it's the things that you do regularly for yourself, or bringing that intentionality, bringing some sacred energy, something we need that as humans, and especially sensitive humans, something beyond ourselves sensitive souls yeah, exactly, we need something to pour into those souls. Yeah, this feels like maybe it had that in you all along. It's just tapping into it more.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 31:09
Yeah, it was always in me. I just just be honest. I just never really tapped into it because of just something else. Someone else needed something for me. Their needs was more important than mine. Or this is how I can get love, or this is how I can get love, or this is how I can secure something. But I recognize like I can't. I keep pouring from an empty cup? Yeah, I think.
April Snow: 31:32
Yeah, you get to that point where you just realize I can't do that anymore. I'm at the bottom.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 31:37
And let's call it what it is. As a black woman in America. You know what I mean.
April Snow: 31:40
You're beyond empty Generations of emptiness, yeah.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 31:44
And so living my soft girl life, romanticizing my life. Those are things that my sisters and I have been talking about lately, because I do Marco Polo every day with my best friend she was out in DC and that in itself is routine, structured ritual that really helps me feel grounded and connected, being able to talk verbally, process out loud, and just knowing that driving, driving helps me just regulate as well, but knowing that I am the work, because we are the work right. I do this work because I am contributing to this community by helping little ones have a voice, have a space, feel connected, helping parents as they're parenting, helping adults who haven't even heard the term rest and rejuvenation, relaxed, right, or knowing that they're at burnout, they're at the danger of just crashing out yeah and they're like I need a space to.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 32:47
I love when clients come and say I just need a space to deeply reflect what's going on, just a space to be there, yes to be held. My feelings can be held softly and can be seen with gentle and tenderness that we all deserve yeah, and creating that safe space somewhere.
April Snow: 33:05
That could be the first safe space, the therapy room, potentially. And I just want to go back to something you said which is really important, which is you don't have to earn those spaces, you don't have to earn that self-care and, yeah, you can here. So you're cycle breaking for yourself, for your family, with your kids. You're helping others cycle break, learn to reparent themselves, parent their own children differently than they were parented.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 33:33
Noticing and understanding and leaning with curiosity about it. Not with judgment, just with curiosity.
April Snow: 33:39
What's important about being curious, not judgmental.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 33:44
Curiosity offers a sense of freedom and liberation and the sense of and we're all born with it. Kids are naturally childlike, curious. I love when kids ask why, why? Why? Because that's a kid who's seeking and understanding their world and trying to get input. And when you look at it from a judgment place like why me, why this it's you undo, you're putting an unhealthy amount of guilt. You're putting this unrealistic expectation on yourself to have understood everything that happened to you. Now, it's not why that happened, what happened right as Dr Bruce Perry talked about with Oprah and stuff. But curiosity is, that's been something that's been a strength of mine, like I've dare I say, a value value.
April Snow: 34:29
Yeah, makes sense right something that you hold in esteem. And yeah, instead of criticizing, we can be curious what do I need? What happened to me?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 34:40
it's softer, it, it's softer. It's again the reparenting, the bicycle, breaking processes, being able to tell, talk to your inner child and say I know you're scared, I know you're not understanding why your body, your brain, is sending signals to your body to say these things all the time. And now I am the adult to say it's okay and I get it. And you're right to feel scared and you're right to be questioning why is this happening? What's going on? And you didn't deserve it and you don't deserve it. But let's softly walk away, play with the toy, connect with me and be seen yeah, it's so powerful, you're happy.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 35:30
You say that to me every day honestly, for my mission in life is to like look to help others feel seen, loved and supported. If I had to just be real blunt with you and be like okay, the niche and stuff.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 35:41
It's like I help people break, like no, I want people to feel loved, seen, supported. If this is their first time not feeling it, I want to be able to give them, offer a space that's warm, inviting, curious, kind, so then it can allow your body and your brain to say, okay, perhaps I could lean into being softer to myself, perhaps I didn't deserve what happened, even though the narrative is saying these things, and maybe I could also rewrite the story. Maybe look at the generational gifts I got versus the generational trauma. It's a both. Yeah, I came from a highly structured, matriarchal, beautiful home, no matter what, no matter what was going on. I came from a matriarchal, highly independent, amazing women who poured love into us the best way they can, with what they had and still showed up Full stop.
April Snow: 36:55
Still showed up.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 37:00
And I'm doing that for my kids and it's going to look different and they may say there was things I wish you could have done different and I have to be open to that. I'm open and curious to that. I don't have to like it, Right?
April Snow: 37:13
But I know it's going to happen If they're going to be in somebody's therapist's office.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 37:17
I'm like at least they can say was I had a too good childhood right, slip the other way my mom was too understanding.
April Snow: 37:25
Sometimes I wish, but anyway I can talk, I can ramble oh no, this is beautiful, but even in all in the chain, it seems like you're holding those roots, those values, in place in a different package in a different package which is really beautiful, and just a reminder that it's not all bad. We can look at the nuance, which I know is hard, can take a long time to do that it does yeah but there's maybe some nuggets in there that you want to keep.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 37:54
But yeah, change the narrative, change the packaging, yeah anger a long time clouded my anger, resentment, frustration and just injustices, because when you're hsp, you have a highly sensitive, high sensitivity to any injustice all injustices, injustices, and when, for a long time, if you've been that vocal, outspoken child who's also highly sensitive, always put the kibosh on At some point, you just I can't believe I'm saying this.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 38:29
But the biggest thing, I really my biggest takeaway was like I don't like everybody. Everybody don't got to like me. Why am I people pleasing for people who's got people all over you? Okay, like maybe I should start doing the opposite, like I was just tired of like people pleasing, fawning, not making sure I'm into my words or blunt and have to say sorry and feel bad all the time I just said okay, let me just try the other thing of what if I just I like me and that's enough.
April Snow: 38:56
I like who I am as I am that's it, because if you like yourself, everything else is going to be okay it's going to be okay.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 39:03
But for a long time I didn't think I could. Or yeah, or there's something to fix before I can like myself and I'm like no, I am fine the way I am. I'm a good friend, wife, everything like that. Mother. I try my best, I'm willing to. There's a difference? I'm willing to. There's a difference. I'm willing to accept fault when fault is there.
April Snow: 39:20
That's important.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 39:22
And then also know that if I'm asking questions like am I a good parent, Just the fact that I'm asking that is already.
April Snow: 39:30
That's it. If you're asking those questions, you already know that everything's going to be okay. It's when you're not asking the questions that you're in a deep spot, when it's not even on your radar. Angelique, we have to start to wrap up, but this has been such a good conversation. I feel like I've known you for years.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 39:48
Same same, really, yeah.
April Snow: 39:50
Truly I'm wondering if there's any final messages you have for the listeners who are sensitive cycle breakers themselves.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 39:59
Yes, have for the listeners who are sensitive cycle breakers themselves. Yes, oh, we're worthy of the love that you give to others. So go ahead and take care of yourself. Know that you don't have to all figure it out. Be curious, love others, love yourself and be kind to your mind.
April Snow: 40:15
Thank you for that. It's such a good reminder that you can send that empathy back in and you can start today. Thank you for that.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 40:26
You're welcome.
April Snow: 40:27
For anyone who wants to work with you, which I highly recommend. I'll share all of your resources in the show notes, your website, your social media. You often teach workshops, so folks can find those there.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 40:39
That's right.
April Snow: 40:40
I'm excited to do virtual workshops. Thank you. So anywhere in the world? Yep, beautiful, love that, and so can you tell us a little bit more about working with you, if they're interested in coming to see you for? Therapy or engaging with your other offerings.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 40:54
Absolutely so. I offer individual therapy for adults. I will do play therapy for kiddos from three to 11, as well as starting to see teens.
April Snow: 41:04
Wonderful.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 41:05
Yep, and the best way you can get to me. Obviously, if you live in Kansas and Missouri because I'm licensed there, that'd be great. But I also offer virtual coaching workshops or coaching sessions for those who live out of state to talk about caregiving. If you're caregiving for an older adult or a child and you just want a space to talk and connect, you can do virtual that way, and then I'm located in the Midtown Westport area in Kansas City and open for practice. Please feel free to visit the website. I also do speaking engagements, happy to talk to your school, your retreat, your corporate retreats, to talk about creativity and play therapy.
April Snow: 41:42
I love it. So many beautiful offerings folks can tap into because, yeah, if you're caregiving, if you're trying to navigate some of these pieces, it's helpful to have a space with someone who gets it.
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 41:53
Absolutely. You're not alone, you're not alone, even if it feels alone, it's absolutely, you're not alone.
April Snow: 42:00
You know, even if it feels alone, it's very isolative being a caregiver?
Angelique Foye-Fletcher: 42:02
it is absolutely. It can be, so just have a space to dedicated to talk about all the things yeah, and you can create a safe space for them that's right yeah, I love it.
April Snow: 42:09
thank you so much. Thanks so much for joining me and Angelique for today's conversation. What I hope you remember is that, even if you didn't grow up being encouraged to embrace your sensitivity or to prioritize your needs, you can start now. It's never too late If you need space and support to reset. Join Angelique for one of her Rest and Rejuvenate virtual sessions or work with her one-to-one. All details are on her website at foyerfletchertherapycom. Foyer, spelled F-O-Y-E. All links are in the show notes. If you enjoyed this episode, subscribe to the Sensitive Stories podcast so you don't miss our upcoming conversations. Reviews and ratings are also helpful and appreciated For behind-the-scenes content and more HSB resources. You can sign up for my email list or follow Sensitive Strengths on Instagram, tiktok and YouTube. Check out the show notes or sensitivestoriescom for all the resources from today's episode. Thanks for listening.
